12.26.2008

First Breath

I will probably regret posting this, but so be it. I can't hold it in because the joy in my soul is tangible, even as much as it might seem to some of you that I have lost my way. Dawn is rising. I am at a place where I need no lectures on the faithfulness of God. I have been around that block, the scenery is so familiar, but it is no longer home, nor real, to me. And I, for one, find no despair in that notion, instead I find healing, a drawing in to something I have carried in the depths of me for so very long. It is in the God I have tried to summon through Christianity that I find despair. This change of focus sets me free. It releases me from a lifetime of unrealistic expectations that have felt to be dirt on my coffin, suffocating me. Today, I breathe.

This time of year, the week between Christmas and New Years, always finds me dark and melancholy and introspective. I have come to anticipate it, even look forward to it in all it's depressiveness, for it often brings me insight that I crave the rest of the year. It is my time to be me, to look inside and not fear what I might see. To take the time to process what I do not have time for any other day of the year.

This week between also brings my birthday, which, in fact, is not a cause for sadness. I look forward to it, for as they say, the alternative is worse. Truly, but it does probably explain the inwardness that comes. So each year at Christmas I feel a maturing that I don't expect. This year has been enormous for me in the maturity department, and I suppose that is why there have been more growing pains for me this Christmas, because I lost it like never before. I have had to stretch and learn in painful ways this year, sometimes afraid I will blow my stitching and come apart completely.

After everyone left Christmas eve, we still had many Christmas duties to attend to: get the kids to bed, do the dishes, and all those other things that come to parents with this holiday, and it blew my gasket. I had dealt with some family conflicts earlier in the day, and although they were small in and of themselves, they highlighted something that had been building in me for months: an overwhelming sense of failure. It has been eating away at my psyche, my heart and soul.

Your first instinct will be to chide me, to tell me all the ways in which I have succeeded, all the failures which are not my fault, or that I could not have prevented. Let me be clear, I don't take these burdens on myself as ways in which I personally have failed (though in some situations one could argue that I could have done more), but ways in which my God has failed me...and not even me, but people who are so important to me. I truly cannot share all the details, for it would be exposing private matters. However, I count 8 major failures in one year, involving death, life changing events, and the breakdown of significant relationships, not just mine, but between people I love. Why will God not solve these things? Christmas for me brought something to the surface, maybe the reason I have struggled so these last years.

Christmas eve night found me wandering the neighborhood in two feet of snow in my pajamas at 1 AM Crying, no, sobbing and wailing for all that is lost and all that has failed this year. For all the ways I have failed to contribute in meaningful ways to situations beyond my control. For all the ways God has not come through in the sense that my evangelical self would normally believe him to.

I have found three things in this night of my heaviest weeping in many years. One, God is so much more than I could ever imagine, for he is in the air and the trees and the light and the earth, the blood in our veins and the oxygen in our lungs. Two, God is not a vending machine somewhere outside me that I can seek solutions from. Three, I have failed at one thing that tears at my heart, one thing that I dream I one day will succeed where God has apparently failed, the thing that keeps me awake at night.

Today I can't help but believe that God is each of us, collectively we are God. We are what has the ability to change things, even one small thing, or many immense things. If God is nothing but good, then he cannot exist, for there are many crying out to him every moment of every day for whom he does nothing to ease their suffering. If God is not nothing but good, then he is not God. For a good God could not turn a deaf ear and a blind eye. So in that, I have failed. I have failed to do my part to be God to the world. In so many and countless ways, but in this one way that has settled in my heart and that rips my soul to shreds every night as I try to sleep. This way that haunts my dreams and shakes me to the core at least once each day.

Common sense would say "Do not dwell on what you cannot change". I would say "Can't I?"

Today I know that when I cry out to God, I cry out to that which is good and strong and deep within me, the power to endure, the ability to act, and the wisdom to move forward. I cannot blame God for failure that is not his to own. And this brings an unraveling of chains that have bound me.

I know I cannot walk away from the idea of God, it is in my dna, in my atoms and electrons. I can, however, walk away from a God whom I expect anything from that I myself have failed to participate in. God is in my breath, in my humanness. He is in his humanness in my humanness, and for that I love him. But he does not live where we think he lives, he lives in the love, in the ligaments in each of us that moves us to do something kind, loving, meaningful. He lives in our learning to be excellent to each other, and the ways we develop his nature in our nurture.

This is not my last word on the subject, just my word for today. And today, I am not sure I still am able to cling to any shreds of that god which I have mostly left behind and still possess any desire to remain among the living. For if God is the God we believe and the world is in the condition it is in, then he has failed. If that damns me to eternal hell, I'm not sure it would be worse than the pain of this life, anyhow. For I sense the suffering and cries that are not heard, and I fade to black and die for the God that does not answer.

And in this admission I have finally reclaimed that elusive final part of myself I have been reaching out towards for many years. The pieces of me that have been scattered far and away but that have been crawling to me, seeking for so long have all come home. Letting go of an impossible notion of a magic God is a freedom that I will soak in for a very long time, and it allows me to reconcile a million conflicts I have struggled to carry for almost 20 years.

And this Christmas day, when I woke, for the first time in all those years, I felt the light inside me brighten rather than dim, as it typically does each day I age and die a little more. Yesterday, in the wee dawn hours as I walked in the snow, I took my first breath as a whole person. It was the morning of my birth.

I will be 38 on Monday and I am finally entering the world of life and light.

80 comments:

  1. Happy Birthday Erin and welcome to your new life!

    This was simply beautiful.

    ReplyDelete
  2. Wow, baby baby baby baby :)

    Rock on into the light, Erin Word Dude.

    ReplyDelete
  3. Erin,
    This is strong and beautiful. Happy Birthday!

    ReplyDelete
  4. i am glad that it is brightening and not dimming

    ReplyDelete
  5. So I'm curious . . . what does this leave you thinking in respect to Jesus?

    ReplyDelete
  6. Happy birthday!

    I don't think I'd be willing to go as far as saying that we, collectively, are God. I believe God is someone separate from me. However, I agree that we have had completely unrealistic expectations of God. We have ideas of a God who can do anything, but is that the God of the Bible or the God our cultures have created?

    Don't ever stop asking questions, Erin. We may come to different conclusions on things, but the ability to question the status quo is a precious thing.

    ReplyDelete
  7. Thanks Mike, and thanks!

    ReplyDelete
  8. Sue - You inspire me, you know?

    ReplyDelete
  9. Jeff - Me too. I can't even explain it...but it's a good thing.

    ReplyDelete
  10. Sara - Somehow I knew you would ask that ;-) Umm, I suppose that is another post altogether. I know Jesus has power in my life, I can't deny that, he is supernatural in my spirit. But as for theology...I don't have clear thoughts on it just yet.

    ReplyDelete
  11. Barry - I think that is what I have shed, the god our religious culture has created, which is a great deal of the problem I have fought and dealt with for many years.

    ReplyDelete
  12. You know what I was thinking after I was pondering this post as I walked my dog yesterday? I was thinking about how there just must be freedom to follow the threads as we see them, to follow them down, and up, into places that are possibly a bit strange to others.

    I guess I'm with Barry in saying that I believe that there is a God out there separate to us, but I am with you that incarnation means that where he is is right slap bang in the middle of all of us. So in that sense, I agree to a degree that we are God. I think it is so close to that this is why some other cultures or people claim that we actually are God and then fall into all sorts of ditches. But hey, ditches are there to be fallen into sometimes. You learn good shit in the ditch.

    I am just really glad that you felt able to talk about this on your blog, and that you haven't deleted this post yet :)

    I was thinking too about how so many of the words we use carry slightly different meanings and connotations for different people, so that we can only really ever convey a "sort of" that we are seeing, but never really the entirety. And because of the differences in word use, sometimes what we are conveying can be construed totally differently by someone who has not even begun to see step A when you are talking from a position of step K.

    Which is why I love the freedom that I find online, and the grace to allow each other to go where we need to. It's a beautiful thang :)

    ReplyDelete
  13. Sorry to word vomit in your comments :)

    ReplyDelete
  14. Im speechless so I will email you my thoughts later.

    I knew your bday was on Monday so I will wait till then to wish you a happy one.

    ReplyDelete
  15. I'm finding the more enlightening moments I have the less I know.
    This clarifies much for me Erin.
    You are an inspiration of what it's like to live OUTSIDE the box.
    And honestly that seems more rare than it should be.

    Again, thank you.

    ReplyDelete
  16. Erin,it's been so long since I have read any blogs and as always girlfriend you blow me away.

    I too become dark and introspective on my birthday. It always brings a sense of failure of what I am not or what I have failed to do. And most of the time it is a realization that my life tends to run me and not me run my life. Make sense? IDK.

    I just gotta say here Erin...that you have been God in my life. You have poured out love and lifted me up so often. In these very acts you were the hands and feet and heart of God. THAT is not chiding. Thats gut level honest.

    Thanks for the raw and real that you give away. Dang it girl...you SO ROCK!!

    Praying that this birthday and the coming year will bring you into a place of clarity, peace, and strength. HUGS!!!

    ReplyDelete
  17. Very beautiful Erin. Love ya. Keep questioning and seeking.

    ReplyDelete
  18. erin- as you know we were travelling yesterday and i'm just now getting here.

    turning points are good things, though almost always painful. the only part of what you wrote that really upsets me is that you walked in the snow in your pajamas-and that of course freaks me out. :-)

    the other stuff- doesn't at all bother me. maybe we should have a better term for hitting these places spiritually--it isn't the bottom is is? because you found something there. there probably is a term that i just don't know. maybe it's epiphany. i think that's it. finding the light in the darkness isn't always pleasant. but necessary. you've verbalized things many of us feel to some degree. i needed to hear it to be sure.

    i know tomorrow is your birthday- happy birthday in advance! i'll be on the road again tomorrow., don't know how my day will play out.

    thanks so much for posting this.

    ReplyDelete
  19. Epiphany. I love that word. The way it piffs itself into the middle of your head. Piff!

    :)

    Good time of year for epiphanies

    ReplyDelete
  20. Simplistically speaking.. perhaps you have simply shed the God of your mind to embrace the God of your heart?

    Happy Birthday Erin!

    ReplyDelete
  21. Erin,

    Happy Birthday!

    I got all knotted up in my stomach as I read your post because it articulates a similar battle that I've been facing these past few years.

    I believe that we are the vessels through which God often works. I, too, see the cries of those in need in the world. I get frustrated and angry because I want to help them but don't have the resources (money, time, knowledge, ability, or whatever) to help. All I can do is pray, and I do, but I wonder if those are even answered when I see so much suffering. Why am I so hamstringed? I feel that all I can do is see and hear and cry. It's maddening and confusing. It was almost easier when I didn't see or hear.

    I'm not at a place of being able to breathe yet, but I appreciate your vulnerability. It helps to know that someone is on a similar journey.

    ReplyDelete
  22. Sue - You are so right that we can never really clearly convey a meaning, especially in the multinational audience, but even with real life people, because words have so many different meanings to people.

    So I can't say I'm sure there is a God outside of us, and if there is, then what role does he really play in this mess? Because I don't see it. I feel something and know there is something supernatural and spiritual that I can't explain...but is it really God as we know him?

    ReplyDelete
  23. Barbara - I'm sure we'll talk about this more.

    ReplyDelete
  24. Rhonda - I agree that the less I know the happier I am. I'm glad this is encouraging to you, but please don't take too much inspiration from me...find your own way. Because I'm wandering as much as anyone.

    ReplyDelete
  25. Tara - You are so sweet, your comment touched my heart. Thank you so much for being an inspiration to me...facing the tough things in life CAN be done, and I get that from you. But I also know we can't run away from things just because they are scary. That's where I am.

    ReplyDelete
  26. Thanks Lyn. I'm trying, but it's tough.

    ReplyDelete
  27. Cindy - I suppose it could be an epiphany, or just batshit crazy, but I guess we already knew that. But finding the light in the dark is healing for me as ugly and messy as it might be.

    You have safe travels while on the road.

    ReplyDelete
  28. Kansas Bob - I think you are right...but it's scary because it's so against what I've tried to swallow, or to conjure up, for so many years. But it feels good!

    ReplyDelete
  29. Mary - You'll get there, to the breathing place, but don't rush it because the journey has so much in it. I too feel hamstrung, but then I think about the people that doesn't stop, and wonder simply what step to take next. Because If I'm not being God to the world in the way I feel called, I won't ever sleep well at night. That is in me for a reason.

    ReplyDelete
  30. So much of Evangelical Christianity adheres to a quazi-pseudo-intellectualism Erin.. it reminds me of these things that Jesus told the Pharisees:

    Go and learn what this means, ‘I desire mercy, and not sacrifice.’ For I came not to call the righteous, but sinners.”
    ...
    And if you had known what this means, ‘I desire mercy, and not sacrifice,’ you would not have condemned the guiltless.


    I think that we are deceived when we think that we can understand God with our heads. Things like mercy can only be understood (and felt) with the heart.

    ReplyDelete
  31. Bob - I think I have deconstructed about 90% of "old" christianity into something heart and not head. The one thing I still have wrestled with is suffering. And I've really tried to find an answer that is theologically sound and biblical, but I simply can't. So then I have to decide which idea right: either God can act and chooses not to (therefore he is not entirely good as I have believed him to be) or he IS good but cannot act, and he is simply waiting for US to act in his place.

    I think I have chosen that God is good, because there is nothing in the fibers of my being that say he is not good. So the alternative is maybe he doesn't really do for us like evangelicalism would like to think. Instead he has given us the heart and will and tools to do good for each other.

    So that's where I'm at.

    ReplyDelete
  32. When Jesus chose not to rescue John the Baptist from jail He told this to his disciples:

    "And blessed is he who does not take offense at Me."

    John had an expectation that Jesus would rescue him.. but he didn't.. he had to suffer in jail (where he eventually was beheaded) - and all Jesus could tell him was don't be offended.

    I think that many people are offended in the same way because God doesn't make sense to our heads.. our heads are not capable of understanding pain and suffering.

    For me, I see nobility in suffering.. a chance for faith to shine when everything is really dark. Really.. if it wasn't for pain and suffering what would we need God for.. what would ever cause us to seek Him out?

    Hope I didn't ramble too long.. the topic is complex one and I really can't speak to anyone's individual pain.. just my own.

    ReplyDelete
  33. Now that I definitely agree with. God is good, but not all-powerful. We have to help ourselves, and he helps when he is able. That's how I see it, anyway.

    If God was both good and all-powerful, then he'd have some serious explaining to do as to why suffering exists.

    ReplyDelete
  34. Kansas Bob: It's hard to see any nobility in suffering when it's you or someone close to you who is suffering. That explanation sounds like divine sadism to me.

    ReplyDelete
  35. Divine sadism when you process pain with your head Barry :)

    ReplyDelete
  36. Kansas Bob: I'm processing the pain in a much more personal way than just in my head at the moment. To give you a few exaples, my wife is chronically ill and in a lot of pain, with no light at the end of the tunnel at the moment. I have had friends die needless, messy deaths. Many people in my area live in poverty, with little or no prospect of escaping from it. Pain and suffering take on an entirely different character when they have a face - especially if that face is the face of someone you know and love.

    To say that these situations are the will of an all-powerful and loving God is beyond belief. If God is all-powerful and suffering is God's will, then God is not loving and merciful - in other words, that idea totally contradicts the Bible, which states that God is love.

    ReplyDelete
  37. Well I wrote a long comment and blogger ate it. Haven't had that happen in a long time.

    Barry - I might be wrong, but I think you and Bob have more in common than you think.

    So many of us have seen real suffering, and I think sadism is a harsh word. But I also know that one has to reconcile the idea that God could do something and doesn't with the idea that God is good, and we will all come out on that in a different place.

    For me, I just can't be OK with it. I just can't look at God and say "well OK, I guess you know what you are doing" with all I have been through in the last year.

    I think maybe, and again, this is just me, that when people suffer with illness and death, it's not really a matter of what God does/does not do, but a matter of what we as human beings and our medicine is able/not able to do. When we take the responsibility off God, we can cease to blame him. But I'm only barely digging into this so that thought could develop or change.

    ReplyDelete
  38. Hi Barry,

    Didn't mean to give you a snarky answer.. sometimes the New Yorker in me speaks a bit quickly :)

    You and I seem to have similar experiences.. my first wife died after suffering 4 years, my kids have/had all sorts of problems and my second wife has been in a wheelchair over a year now.. so I don't mean to trivialize what you have and are going through.

    I think that bad things just happen within the confines of creation as we know it.. if they didn't happen then life would not be life as we know it. It is bad when it happens to us because pain gets personal - and I don't like it at all.

    But to say that God is not good or is weak just because He allows pain seems to be misunderstand the purpose of pain and suffering.. which, in part anyway, is a way that humility comes to our lives.

    This is not heaven.. Jesus said that we will have trials.. we will have pain. I think that people can have noble responses to pain.. I think that how we handle pain says more about us than how we respond to anything else in life.

    Again.. I can only speak for my own pain.. and I have to admit that some days I do not sound quite as sanctimonious as I might sound today.

    Shalom, Bob

    ReplyDelete
  39. Oh, and Barry, your last paragraph pretty much sums up where I'm at. It can't be both ways, it's either/or. He can't be all good and all powerful, or we'd live in a perfect will. So which is it? That's what I'm seeking the answer to, and in my heart and soul I have to believe God is good...therefore maybe he leaves more up to us than we think.

    ReplyDelete
  40. Bob - I would add that I believe it is God that gives us the strength to endure and to keep hoping. Because left to our own devices, with no ability to hope, we'd all just lay down and die.

    ReplyDelete
  41. This is good Erin..

    "I have to believe God is good...therefore maybe he leaves more up to us than we think"

    ..it doesn't make God weak.. it just puts His power in perspective.. just because He can act doesn't mean that it is His job to act.

    ReplyDelete
  42. That sums up what I mean. There are evil people and there is selfishness and starvation and disease. But how much is ultimately God's responsibility to take care of miraculously and how much is our responsibility to take care of through kindness and generosity and compassion?

    And there are things humanity is unable to solve...like some diseases for instance. But does that mean God HAS to step in, or does it just mean humanity has failed to have all the answers yet?

    A good friend of mine lost her best friend in a car accident about 18 months ago. The driver who hit her was at fault. I have never heard if he was impaired or just made a mistake, but it was human error, caused by one human's mistake. So is it God's fault that she died or is it that human being's fault for whatever mistake he made? And was it God's responsibility to step in to prevent it, or does God leave more up to humanity than we think?

    So if God is not to blame, then what is his role? I believe it is to give us the strength to carry on, to endure and to continue to be alive (emotionally/spiritually). God is that which is in us that gives us the ability and motivation to endure.

    ReplyDelete
  43. This comment has been removed by the author.

    ReplyDelete
  44. Ditto that for me Erin.. this is what I wrote on Friday..

    "Very often we are oblivious to the presence of the grace that comes when we pray because we do not understand that a primary reason that grace is given is to help us to endure - we need grace to endure.. and grace comes by way of prayer.

    ReplyDelete
  45. So then I come to my next question: does prayer really ever change anything about circumstances? I know if straightens me, but I don't think the act of praying really will heal someone or cause some miracle. I do believe things that "seem" to be miracles happen, but I also know many times miracles are prayed for fervently and don't happen. And those "miracles" are just as likely to happen to non-christians than christians. So then what? When we choose to believe God causes miracles, or that prayer makes thins better, especially if we have seen it happen, then we will struggle when miracles DON'T happen. We will be angry with God, we will believe he has failed us, we will even lose faith entirely. So again, what is his responsibility...to fix things or to grant us the grace to endure them?

    Again, I'm deconstructing typical evangelical answers in this because it has to become real to me.

    ReplyDelete
  46. Yeah Erin.. some people pray for miracles the way that some play the lottery.. I call it the miracle lottery :)

    ReplyDelete
  47. Wow. This is such an awesome conversation :) This is surely the crux of everything, isn't it? Ye olde suffering thang. Surely this is the bottom of the barrel where people get, and look around, and say, "Well, that's it, I wash my hands of any God who is so pathetically weak he can't step in." It's so good to talk about this stuff with people.

    I've raised my fist at God and screamed and ranted and raved along with everyone else. Those 6+ years I was ill were hell on earth and he could have reached out and helped me, and he didn't. And that was a more minor thing compared to some of what people are enduring. And yet I couldn't get away from the idea, even while shaking my fist and literally swearing at him, that he was love, that he cared for me, that he was all the things I needed him to be and more. And that still has been my experience but it's DESPITE the sufferings. And yet out of each suffering comes something that was not there before. So I can only surmise that part of this life involves furnace experiences. That we are cleansed through our sufferings. I guess that's why I read those words Kansas Bob wrote about Jesus saying, "And blessed is he who does not take offence in me" and they just smacked me between the eyes. I don't think I have ever quite read them before with the same sort of intensity.

    I guess this is heading into spiritual meat territory, the wrestling. Why does he not do more? And yet, maybe as you said, Erin, it's more a case of, "Why aren't we doing more?" But then of course we will only do more when we trust that he is as good and as love and as wonderful as we need him to be. And as a Church, I don't think we're quite there yet.

    Anyway, I vomited again. Sorry. But this topic, it's just the crux for me of everything. Suffering. Trust. What we believe about God. The questions we have that flow after that belief. I get angry at God sometimes for not making it all clearer, you know?

    ReplyDelete
  48. No, no...no vomit. It's beautiful Sue!

    But what I really struggle with is the different kinds of suffering. Like there is suffering and then there is suffering How can there be a loving God when there are babies watching their parents get hacked to death or being sold into sex slavery or worse? Where is God in that? That is where I feel I have failed, not God. Not even me individually but humanity as a whole. I think modern Christianity wants to be relieved of this responsibility by praying and tithing and "God's will"-ing it away.

    We don't want to have to deal with it so we make it God's problem...and this is where I think we have failed. I don't know yet what I'm supposed to do but I'm done with blaming God for what I'm, what humanity, is NOT doing.

    But I can't abandon God, for it is by him that I even have the desire to be part of something bigger than myself, than my piddly little suburban housewife world.

    Christianity, the CHURCH has so much power, so much money, yet there is still ethnic cleansing going on. We saw Valkyrie last night, and while it was excellent and all, it really got me thinking about how we today reflect on WWII and Hitler and the concentration camps and wonder how it could happen and we're so sorry and all. But the thing is, the western world, hell even many of Hitler's own followers, didn't really know about what was really going on until after D-day.

    Yet here, today, we have Darfur and we DO know about it and the atrocities and we STILL don't do anything about it. The church could do so much but they'd rather have their 40 foot screens. Oh but they PRAY for Darfur so the ball is in God's court and it's his problem.

    Sigh.

    ReplyDelete
  49. I in Him,
    He in me,
    He as me.
    Teresa of Avila.

    I'll meditate on what you've written and on the following discussion and post on my blog. I would take up too many column inches here in a rambling response.

    ReplyDelete
  50. I look forward to it Gary.

    What I feel is simple: giving God permission not to be who I've tried to make him to be and being careful what I blame him for or believe his responsibilities are.

    ReplyDelete
  51. Erin, your comments on the issue of God and suffering really resonate with me. I responded with a post. Not a comfortable post, nor a short one.

    ReplyDelete
  52. I enjoyed reading both this post and the ensuing discussion, Erin. I don't have much to add at this point, but I want to wish you the best as you continue this journey.

    Oh, and happy belated birthday!

    ReplyDelete
  53. only 38! wow, you are still young!

    i also live in oregon.
    how about that snow?
    i am glad for the big melt.

    it is good to talk or write these thoughts out. i think to write or speak helps to process it through our brain and heart.

    ReplyDelete
  54. Good morning Erin..I hope you are enjoying this day of your birth!!

    Have I mentioned lately that I love you? I love your heart and the willingness to work thru the tough thoughts that circle in your head. I'm SO glad you had that early morning walk and could write the words to share it with us. God is amazing and so my friend are you!

    ReplyDelete
  55. Gary - I'll read it as soon as I can. I'd love to hear what you think about all this.

    ReplyDelete
  56. Thanks Jarred. I appreciate you.

    ReplyDelete
  57. Hi Nancy - Welcome! I am very glad to see grass these days, I think that's about enough snow for one year. But we'll see. Do you live in the Portland area too?

    I absolutely agree that writing and talking it out makes it so much clearer.

    ReplyDelete
  58. Thank you Donna. I don't like having to work through the tough things because it's really uncomfortable, but it's so necessary. Thank you so much for being there for me through it all.

    I can have time on Friday if that works for you, the rest of the week is a little full. Or the kids go back next week, we can wait until then, too.

    ReplyDelete
  59. Great post (and comments too). For me the biggest question of all time is why God allows so much suffering and horrible things to happen.

    An interesting thought - A friend recently commented to me how arrogant we are to assume we deserve or have the right to a certain number of years on this earth. The same thing could apply to feeling we deserve or have a right to a pain free life. That still doesn't reconcile everything in my mind, but it's a good point.

    ReplyDelete
  60. simply beautiful, erin. one breath at a time...love ya kathy

    ReplyDelete
  61. As usual I'm a little late getting here, at least this time I can use Christmas as an excuse!

    I did read your post several days ago and as I thought about it I was reminded of The Shack.

    God took MacKenzie on a journey that would deliberately shatter his religious caricatures of God. I think, maybe God is doing the same thing to you. He is shattering the caricature of God being a vending machine or a magic genie. When we give up the false we make room for truth. I did write something about the "magic genie" God here if you are interested.

    ReplyDelete
  62. ...and belated birthday greetings. Hope you had a great day.

    ReplyDelete
  63. Susan - Thank you for sharing those thoughts. It's reassuring to me to know that other people understand.

    And you're not late, as it is still my birthday here where I live! Thank you!

    ReplyDelete
  64. Randy - I think maybe we evangelicals do have a sense of entitlement when it comes to God. The only thing we are really entitled to is relationship with him. All else is gravy.

    ReplyDelete
  65. Thank you Kathy...look forward to seeing you. Hope we can have time to chat!

    ReplyDelete
  66. i guess i have to ask before i just assume. it would seem to me to be the general (although not total) consensus: if god indeed has the ability to prevent or alleviate suffering, then he is then bound to do so in order to be able to bestow the title of "good" upon himself.

    just so i'm not mistaken, and can understand others clearly, is this an accurate representation of anyone's perspective? if so, how? if not, what is different about your perspective?

    hope it's not too personal to ask such a penetrating question of everyone.

    as to another one of your(erin) thoughts on god: i just noticed last year that when the pharisees accuse jesus of calling himself god, jesus doesn't say, "i am god, silly." no, his response is far more enigmatic. especially when you consider the audience. he responds to their accusation by pointing out that the scripture say we are all gods. (john 10:33-34.)

    i found that very cool. in so many ways, you are right, erin. we ARE gods. we are LIVING BEINGS ON A BLANK SLATE. so much power rests within our hands. so much so that we don't even realize.

    the fact that ipods or cars or 150 story hotels exist is because we make them exist every day. we use our hands, our talents, our abilities and time and money and resources every day maintaining a fundamentally flawed paradigm of existence when it need never be this way.

    if we can, by organizing ourselves in just such a way, reach down into the dirt and pull out an ipod, we have more power than we can even begin to fathom. the power to live. the power to dream. the power to do. there are billions of other organic entities that do not have even a tiny fraction of that power.

    in fact, we have so much power that we have created this intricate system of being and living and operating for humans.

    we don't often realize that it is imaginary and doesn't exist. (perhaps because we call it the "real world." funny how we always have to keep reminding ourselves of that. you would think that if it was the "real world" it would come a little more naturally...)

    it only exists because we take the earth's resources and MAKE it exist. but if we stopped producing it and calling it "real", without giving it a name and priority and care and hard work, it would cease to exist.

    that IS god-like power that we fail to exercise, for the benefit of everyone, every day. and i can't help but wonder just how many of the evils and sufferings in the world aren't a direct result of that one simple fact.

    this is a GREAT subject you have hit on here. as always, thank you for your raw and gritty honesty. with yourself, and with us. it is a privilege to know, walk, and talk with you.

    i mean, it's not like i get this kind of conversation with the person in front of me at the grocery store.

    or do i?

    ReplyDelete
  67. I'll jump in, jONNO (love these questions)

    if god indeed has the ability to prevent or alleviate suffering, then he is then bound to do so in order to be able to bestow the title of "good" upon himself

    Hmmmm. No, this isn't an accurate representation of my perspective. However, I don't know if I could say what my perspective is hehe :) I bleat about this a lot because I don't understand it - most especially when the furnace heat is turned up high and I'm burnin'. But ... hmmm, even though I am in the midst of suffering of some sort and I know God can step in but he doesn't ... it doesn't negate my faith. It just increases the mystery. I just can't get any closer to it than that, even though I get excessively angry at him when it comes to entire countryloads of people starving to death.

    I guess I just feel like we see so little from our perspective where we are. I do feel he cries with us. This answer is not getting any closer. I don't know how to chip away at this whole thing and get any closer to it. It certainly hasn't happened yet tonight :(

    ReplyDelete
  68. So Jon, never one to ask difficult questions or anything... ;-) I love your last little enigmatic comment.

    Ok so if God CAN alleviate suffering, does it mean he HAS to in order to be good?

    I think maybe this isn't the right approach, so I would say, no...well a few weeks ago this would have been my belief, but as I am always deconstructing...it no longer is.

    God has given humanity a great deal of responsibility which we misuse and abuse and generally don't do good with. Yes some people do a lot of good and most people do some good, but few do mostly good. And we all do some evil too.

    So we fail to use our power to make the world better...and I think you would agree that it probably is greed that causes that. Even those of us who would have things be different are stuck eking out an existence because of "the man" (big business) that has made any kind of standard of living impossible unless we are almost entirely self-focused.

    But, in the big picture, it really is our responsibility to make things better, and I am learning that I have to be careful how much I blame God for.

    For instance, (as you know) my mom in law is halfway to vegetable from a supposedly "routine" surgery 7 months ago. She will never be the same and may never walk or do much of anything for her self again. For awhile I was really mad at God for this mess. But as I have got to thinking about it, it really was a series of human error, and even human selfishness that failed her. Not God. Humans have more responsibility to each other than much of Christian religion would have us believe. I have spent my life being taught that my greatest responsibility to others is to pray for them...now I'm not so sure. I think it's a far greater responsibility to actually DO GOOD.

    So does that sort of answer your question?

    ReplyDelete
  69. Holy Crap Erin, I have so many things to talk about on this. Sorry, it will be long.

    First:"But I can't abandon God, for it is by him that I even have the desire to be part of something bigger than myself, than my piddly little suburban housewife world."
    If every parent in this world, raised great kids, that became great adults, then the world would not be in this mess.

    God being Good. I wonder, have you ever had to dicsipline your children? Does this cause them suffering? To mine it definately does. So when personal things happen, often it is to teach us something. What, we will never know. I gave up trying to figure it out.

    Suffering in general. My wife has been on dialysis for 23 years. This SUCKS!!!!!! She has almost died on me so often, I do not know how many times that is. But, our love would not be so wonderful or strong without it. So, up to you guys to decide on that one.

    This is the argument I like best. If God created everything, he also created evil. Think on that one.

    Blaming God. I only think that you can blame God for everything, if you truly belive that he has predestined everything to happen. So that every little encounter you have through your whole life was scripted before you were born. I believe that he has certain BIG things planned, and makes sure they happen, but for the most part, leaves us on our own.

    Late Happy 38th (again?) just joking.

    Lastly, finding that God you know, rather than the one you were forced to swallow is always a wonderful thing. I am happy you found him. Love always-

    ReplyDelete
  70. Hi Nate. I'm glad to hear your thoughts on this. And I never mind long comments.

    I have never liked the discipline analogy, because for one thing God is perfect and we are not. For another, discipline is a shaming event, even for a child, and I can't believe God operates that way. I know that for many Christians that is the best way for it to make sense, but I have never had peace with it.

    I know some religions believe God actually has two sides, both Good and Evil...and again, while this solves a very complex problem, it doesn't work for me. For me, God is all that is good and kind and loving and compassionate in this world. This idea could explain why humans have evil in them...because I have not yet been able to resolve why humans are not perfect if we were made in God's image...I know the story of the fall and the serpent works well to answer that, but I can't believe in it literally, nor can I believe that humanity would find it so simple to turn from perfection into selfishness if we WERE perfect to begin with.

    As far as suffering, I try to sort it into two general categories. One is the kind we have no control over...certain kinds of illness for instance, and all other things that are not caused directly or indirectly by other humans. The other is the suffering some people experience at the hands of other people, either directly or indirectly, or suffering that is preventable...and that is the one that I really can't reconcile to the existence of a Good God. Humans are evil, and by that I mean some are truly evil an some are simply selfish.

    I know it is the ageless question and for most of my life I have been content to say that ultimately God is in control and I don't need to know the answers, but today it boils down to either God is entirely good but helpless or God is not entirely good and turns a blind eye. Or the one alternative I have found...that God leaves far more up to humanity than we would like to think and that maybe he has nothing to do with suffering or pain or evil, but instead by his grace and wisdom, gives us whatever we have within us that allows us to endure.

    I do think I'm answering some of my own questions simply by talking it out with you guys...so thank you.

    ReplyDelete
  71. I have been reading a 1,000 pages a week for a long time. Most of them, non religious books. One that I think spoke to me most of all on the nature of God, was Th God Emporer Of Dune, Herbert is the last name of the Author. He created the Dune series.

    For me, he is capricious. He does things for his own pleasure. "We were created for his pleasure" What is his pleasure? My belief is his creations. That is why he loves us so much. But, I see us as an ant farm like thing here on earth. He created us, and can see everything that we do. He takes pleasure from that. He becomes involved in our lives by watching. But does he direct everything? No. He lets us live our lives, but gives urges through the holy spirit in all of us to tell us the path. He urged you out the door in your PJs, and you found something he wanted you to find. We can pray for wisdom and guidance, and listen to those urges of the Holy Spirit for the answers. The expression "peace about a situation" comes from. The peace is the understanding that you have found the urge of the holy spirit. I digress. Getting off subject here.

    God can prevent all suffering. ALL OF IT. But that would make life SUCK. And suck big time. Struggle and strife give perspective on everything. Things achieved without much effort, are not very appreciated. But those gained through great effort are cherished most. If following God were easy, it would not be valued. Also, when there is nothing left within us to draw from, God gives us strength. He forces us to rely on him, to bring us closer to him. That really sucks, but it is the truth.

    My thoughts anyway.

    ReplyDelete
  72. I agree Nate, I believe God can prevent all suffering. I also agree with Erin in that, I believe God is good and kind and loving and compassionate. However I don’t see these two things being in disagreement with each other.

    A while ago, Erin you wrote this in a post:

    Part of faith is believing that God knows something we don't. But sometimes whatever it is God knows that we don't makes life seem so absurd. Sometimes I wish we could see with God's eyes, if only for a moment, to know why things like this happen.

    I thought it was so good when you wrote it Erin, that I kept a copy! I believe when it comes to suffering God knows something we don’t. Several places in the Bible hint at it but I believe one day we will see with God’s eyes and then everything will make sense.

    ReplyDelete
  73. I enjoy your thoughts on all this Nate. I know you have a very real perspective. But I still don't know how to be ok with a God who sits by and watches children see or experience some of the awful things that humanity can deal to them. I know there are powerful stories of overcoming adversity and those encourage all of us, but I don't think that excuses the horror that goes on in this world.

    But then God never said he would save any of us from anything, only that he would give us what we need to endure. Still...I struggle.

    ReplyDelete
  74. Susan - Do you know where I wrote that? It doesn't ring a bell and I can't find it.

    Anyhow, thank you, and it's true...but then I think maybe my perspective is changing. There is something that I still haven't touched, something that will make it all come together. Something about God and humanity and life and suffering. There is a piece I feel like I'm drawing nearer to.

    ReplyDelete
  75. It was a bit tricky to find because it is not actually in the post. It is in the comments. The post is called, Getting with it on April 23, 2008.

    ReplyDelete
  76. okay. so i've been whirling this around in my head for awhile. a couple of things have come up.

    first, psalm 34:19."Many are the afflictions of the righteous,
    But the LORD delivers him out of them all."


    i think this is what you are hitting at. nowhere in the bible does god ever make the promise that we will not suffer. only that in the midst of suffering, he will either bear us up or deliver us out. never that we will avoid it, but rather that he will be iwth us in it. and, if he chooses to, deliver us from it.

    i don't want to say anything trite because suffering is real. and i've never lived in a place like darfur or sudan. i can't even comprehend. so they would have to speak of their own experiences. i only know that for all of the pain i have endured, it has only caused me to grow. i don't no why it works that way, but it does. as was said in "i (heart) huckabees", "no manure, no magic."

    paul actually touches on this in romans 8. he makes mention of "god who did not spare his son." and of course, paul moves on, but i think that statement says so much as pertains to this particular discussion. god did not even spare his own son from the suffering in the world. instead, he partook.

    i also saw one of my favorite episodes of south park last week and i thought it had direct bearing on the conversation. so, if you ever feel inclined and have a little time to kill, it is worth it. it is called "cartmanland."

    (sorry about the bikinis...)

    ReplyDelete
  77. Wow thanks for that Susan...I don't even remember writing it...sometimes I surprise myself.

    ReplyDelete
  78. Jon - I think that is key...that he lives in it with us. Like he can't end suffering but he can give us the strength to bear up under it. I have never lived in real suffering...but I think all the time about the people who do...which forces me to answer this question. Then, is it selfish to think that God doesn't do something that I think he should for those who do live in real suffering? How am I to know who God is to them and what he's doing in the midst of it all.

    I think for me it's deconstructing the magic-genie God who grants wishes and parts seas. Into a God who says he will live the life with us but won't deliver us from it before our time.

    I don't know. I'll try to watch that video sometime, but for now I'm going back to bed...did not sleep well at all last night, I think I had too much caffeine before bed.

    ReplyDelete