I have always wondered about Hebrews 10:25 "Let us not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but let us encourage one another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching."
I think this passage has been tossed at me more than any other verse since I left. So what specifically does this passage mean? How should we define "meeting together"? Is it defined by the next phrase "encourage one another"? And should we meet more frequently as time passes?
I did some digging over at BLB...didn't come to any real conclusions. The precise Greek for "meeting together" is episunagoge (Strong's 1997) is only used in one other place: 2 Thes. 2:1 "Concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to him, we ask you, brothers..."
I understand the reasons for the "assembly" i.e. "church"...how important it is just to have corporate worship...for teaching...for encouragement...
...but here's the thing that bothers me...the "encourage" part. If the "gathering" is supposed to be a place of encouragement...a place where I can be held up when I am down, a place where I can be encouraged when I am struggling...a place for support when I am troubled...
...why wasn't it that for me? When I found myself in a season of discouragement and darkness...the "assembly" just kicked me when I was down. "If you really want out, well then good riddance!". There was no sense of uplifting or support.
Certainly if I were to be in a place of grief...they would be there for me, because that is a "righteous" discouragement...but since I was questioning the "assembly" in and of itself, I was basically left to rot in my own bitterness. No one ever offered to dialogue with me about my discouragement...no one ever offered to "meet with me" to encourage me, to discuss the reasons for my struggle. There was no "intervention" when I left...no "why is this happening...is there anything we can do to help?"
Maybe it's because of self-incrimination...I can't expect "in church" believers to dialogue with me about why I left any more than I can expect a criminal on trial to testify against himself (though I like to think we operate the church a little differently than the legal system)...maybe they are afraid of "catching" what I've got. Maybe it doesn't matter...I don't think anything anyone said would have changed my mind. But it does matter, for at least I would have felt loved. I would have felt that the "assembly" cared enough to try. Maybe "church" as we know it isn't the "meeting together" that the Author of Hebrews meant...for he clearly indicates "the meeting" is to be a place of "encouragement"...
I'm not saying I was looking for confrontation...quite the opposite. I am not saying I wanted people to challenge me. Maybe that's what I NEEDED...but what I wanted was for someone to care...for someone to even notice that I was gone. For someone to call and make a date with me....even the people I truly believed were mature enough to notice and care...didn't.
I do know Jesus noticed. I posted awhile back about that. But I am beginning to think more and more that Jesus doesn't see the people who are "out of church" as lost...I think He sees the church as more than just the "church in a building"...so If I am not attending church but I still count myself as part of the Church (big C)...then Jesus sees me as "in" Church and not "out of Church". Get what I'm saying? His definition of "Church" is different from ours.
Considering Matthew 18:20...I have "church" just as often now than when I was in the "regular assembly". I have "church" every time I have coffee and conversation with another believer ...every time I talk to one of my kids about Jesus...every time I interact with another Christian blogger...
So I am struggling with the notion of returning to such a place. I have received more encouragement about my struggles with the "assembly" from other unchurched friends and bloggers than I ever did when I was "in church". And the interesting thing is...these "unchurched" people I associate with are not necessarily singing the praises of being "out", they are not trying to avoid church forever...many of them don't want to be "out", or at least not permanently...they are seeking healing and balancing so they can be healthy enough to return to the "assembly" again. So it's not like we are patting each other on the back for being "out".
If the "church people were so "concerned" about me...worried that I was fallen away or even in danger of losing my salvation because I wasn't attending church...if it was THAT serious...why wasn't anything done to stop me from leaving?
I would think that if it was THAT important to Jesus...He would have seen something done (not just about me but about all who are among the masses in exodus)...goodness knows I PRAYED for Him to stop me..."Protect me from myself, Lord! Protect me from what my humanity would like to do to my faith!"... and yet I was still able to walk out, almost as if on a tether...
I wonder if He smiles as we walk out...knowing we will be more likely to find "the Church" if we are out of "the church".
Note: Here and other places I use "little c" and "big C" to differentiate between the two kinds of church. The church (little c) is the building where we go to attend services and the specific people who belong to such a building. The Church (big C) is Christ's Body as a whole...all the believers in all places...and the way Christ intended US to be and behave. Church (big C) is also used as meaning the "Kingdom of God"... the order in which God would have all things be.
I think this passage has been tossed at me more than any other verse since I left. So what specifically does this passage mean? How should we define "meeting together"? Is it defined by the next phrase "encourage one another"? And should we meet more frequently as time passes?
I did some digging over at BLB...didn't come to any real conclusions. The precise Greek for "meeting together" is episunagoge (Strong's 1997) is only used in one other place: 2 Thes. 2:1 "Concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to him, we ask you, brothers..."
I understand the reasons for the "assembly" i.e. "church"...how important it is just to have corporate worship...for teaching...for encouragement...
...but here's the thing that bothers me...the "encourage" part. If the "gathering" is supposed to be a place of encouragement...a place where I can be held up when I am down, a place where I can be encouraged when I am struggling...a place for support when I am troubled...
...why wasn't it that for me? When I found myself in a season of discouragement and darkness...the "assembly" just kicked me when I was down. "If you really want out, well then good riddance!". There was no sense of uplifting or support.
Certainly if I were to be in a place of grief...they would be there for me, because that is a "righteous" discouragement...but since I was questioning the "assembly" in and of itself, I was basically left to rot in my own bitterness. No one ever offered to dialogue with me about my discouragement...no one ever offered to "meet with me" to encourage me, to discuss the reasons for my struggle. There was no "intervention" when I left...no "why is this happening...is there anything we can do to help?"
Maybe it's because of self-incrimination...I can't expect "in church" believers to dialogue with me about why I left any more than I can expect a criminal on trial to testify against himself (though I like to think we operate the church a little differently than the legal system)...maybe they are afraid of "catching" what I've got. Maybe it doesn't matter...I don't think anything anyone said would have changed my mind. But it does matter, for at least I would have felt loved. I would have felt that the "assembly" cared enough to try. Maybe "church" as we know it isn't the "meeting together" that the Author of Hebrews meant...for he clearly indicates "the meeting" is to be a place of "encouragement"...
I'm not saying I was looking for confrontation...quite the opposite. I am not saying I wanted people to challenge me. Maybe that's what I NEEDED...but what I wanted was for someone to care...for someone to even notice that I was gone. For someone to call and make a date with me....even the people I truly believed were mature enough to notice and care...didn't.
I do know Jesus noticed. I posted awhile back about that. But I am beginning to think more and more that Jesus doesn't see the people who are "out of church" as lost...I think He sees the church as more than just the "church in a building"...so If I am not attending church but I still count myself as part of the Church (big C)...then Jesus sees me as "in" Church and not "out of Church". Get what I'm saying? His definition of "Church" is different from ours.
Considering Matthew 18:20...I have "church" just as often now than when I was in the "regular assembly". I have "church" every time I have coffee and conversation with another believer ...every time I talk to one of my kids about Jesus...every time I interact with another Christian blogger...
So I am struggling with the notion of returning to such a place. I have received more encouragement about my struggles with the "assembly" from other unchurched friends and bloggers than I ever did when I was "in church". And the interesting thing is...these "unchurched" people I associate with are not necessarily singing the praises of being "out", they are not trying to avoid church forever...many of them don't want to be "out", or at least not permanently...they are seeking healing and balancing so they can be healthy enough to return to the "assembly" again. So it's not like we are patting each other on the back for being "out".
If the "church people were so "concerned" about me...worried that I was fallen away or even in danger of losing my salvation because I wasn't attending church...if it was THAT serious...why wasn't anything done to stop me from leaving?
I would think that if it was THAT important to Jesus...He would have seen something done (not just about me but about all who are among the masses in exodus)...goodness knows I PRAYED for Him to stop me..."Protect me from myself, Lord! Protect me from what my humanity would like to do to my faith!"... and yet I was still able to walk out, almost as if on a tether...
I wonder if He smiles as we walk out...knowing we will be more likely to find "the Church" if we are out of "the church".
Note: Here and other places I use "little c" and "big C" to differentiate between the two kinds of church. The church (little c) is the building where we go to attend services and the specific people who belong to such a building. The Church (big C) is Christ's Body as a whole...all the believers in all places...and the way Christ intended US to be and behave. Church (big C) is also used as meaning the "Kingdom of God"... the order in which God would have all things be.
i hear ya Decomp...the passage in Heb is being interpreted through our American filter, our way of doing of church instead, which is a cycle of endless meetings.
ReplyDeleteI do love church, I like to be a part of a group that I can journey together with in our quest to know Jesus. The older I get, though, the more I am beginning to think that church can take on many forms, like you and me having coffee on Wednesday. It's not just about coffee. We'll actually be having church, cause you and I are the church. We are meeting together. We won't have a sound system, or announcements, or a sermon, at least I hope not :-) but we will meet together to encourage and listen to one another about our friendship with Jesus. That's church. Now only a short while ago I would have said Nope, that's not church, that's not an "assemblying together in a congregation"... yet it is, two make a meeting. G Cooke, my favorite guy to quote says, "God doesn't come to meetings. He comes to friendships."
I think Jesus will be with us when we hook up on Wed Decomp...see ya then!
I'm not planning a sermon. You?
ReplyDelete"Decomp"..that's cute as long as people don't think it stands for "decomposing"... ;)
I think that's totally true about the church being anywhere we have gathered. I, too love what Graham says about that. I think church is supposed to be alot easier than we make it...right now it's so complicated that we can't even have church on Christmas, because it's too big a production, needs too many people to be involved...and who wants to spend Christmas "working" at church, putting on the production?
Anyhow, looking forward to our "church" on Weds.